Thanks!
Thanks to everyone who has sent me feedback on the 1.2 release; I've collated and am passing it along. It's great to hear the nearly universal enthusiasm for the product that underlies some snags in the user experience.
Friday, December 29, 2006
About Me
- Name: David Caulton
A Zune contributor by day, I'm also an avid hiker, biker, and father of three, I also work doing industry analysis and strategy. In previous lives, I've been a backcountry ski patroller, worked on the Windows Media Player, Microsoft Word, Microsoft Project, and Microsoft Team Manager 97, been a researcher in Cognitive Neuroscience, a grad student, and a kid.
52 Comments:
How do I send feedback to the Zune team? Just a bunch of suggestions, not hate mail. :)
The KB page on feedback says to call support, but that seems like I'd be wasting someones time.
Hmm, kind of disturbing that you deleted the post about the skipping.
Why does this make me think you're now going into "cover up the problem instead of fixing it" mode?
'Why does this make me think you're now going into "cover up the problem instead of fixing it" mode? '
Is it because you're an idiot? Oh, was that a rhetorical question?
Maybe I am an idiot for buying this thing. Oh well, in three weeks I'll return it if the problem isn't fixed.
Maybe buying this thing and actually expecting it to work does make me an idiot. Oh well, three more weeks until I return it if it's not fixed.
its seems like the skipping on my player is getting worse. A little more and my zune will be unusable. Im verry annoyed to say the least.
Maybe you shouldn't use the marketplace? All my non-drm songs in AAC, MP3, or WMA format all work perfectly.
It's really not that big a deal to use music from another site, and it's perfectly legal. I really think the marketplace is a piece of crap, but hey, that's just me. If it doesn't work for you, don't use it.
Addendum: Yes, they should be more vigilant, and this issue should have been fixed a while ago/never have occurred, but this is precisely why I hate DRM, as it's damn near worthless at actually stopping pirates, and really only serves to piss people off because of its numerous technical problems. I was able to get all my (purchased) PlaysForSure music un-DRM'd, so that I could load it onto my Zune. So far, I haven't had any issues.
I was very surprised when learning that Zune doesn't support language other than English, even though my cheap rio does support Chinese.
I am not sending my Zune back, since I love it and keep deep faith that it won't be an issue sooner or later.
Looking forward to the updates from your team for the language support package!
"Maybe you shouldn't use the marketplace?"
For me, the Zune Pass was the main distinguishing feature that made me want to get the Zune. If I'm going to use non-DRM music, I'll just use an iPod. Only problem with the iPod for me is the lack of a subscription service.
I found this post kind of disappointing. I was hoping to hear that someone at Microsoft acknowledged the problem and was working on it. Instead, this just sounds like 100% PR spin ("some snags in the user experience" indeed).
Check out this guy's blog and listen to the hoops the customer support people are making him jump through to identify what is clearly a problem with the firmware:
http://www.quesocompuesto.com/
I have been "experimenting" (aka so frustrated with the skipping problem I am trying everything to stop it) I have come to find that if I sync albums of artist one by one in the zune marketplace I'm not getting the skipping issue. See if it works.
we still don't have a text reader and a clock..
I guess some people have never heard of the term first generation before...
Never buy a first gen unless you're OK with and expect a few bugs here and there.
- ZuneUser
http://www.zuneuser.com/forums
Well there you have it. Very frustrated with the lack of official response from Microsoft on this issue. We know that it is impacting a lot of people. I'm getting concerned that this is a major design flaw that cannot be addressed through firmware. Either the processor in the device is not powerful enough to handle WMADRM9.1, there is not enough cache memory in the device or something else hardware related. Yes, I have tested and tested and if I ONLY use clean (no DRM) MP3 files, I have no problems. In fact, the device functions 100% faster in general without ZunePass music.
However - the reason I went from the iPOD to the Zune was because of the marketplace.
It will be interesting to see how this plays out. Based on what I see so far, I see one of the following options:
1) MS will need to modify their DRM scheme to be less invasive. This will be no easy task as it would require recoding and renegotiation with the labels as well as a firmware push.
2) If it is a weak hardware issue, MS will need to replace all units. Well, they won't do this, they will release Zune II and expect us to buy new units.
Here's why I feel this way. Come on, it is obvious that Microsoft is trying to cover this issue up - every support tech says that they have never heard of this issue before. We know this is not the case. And based on the velocity of complaints, you can rest assured that if it was addressable with a firmware upgrade, we would already have one.
I'm very concerned that Microsoft realizes that they have "laid an egg" here and frankly, they do not know where to go. I've been researching and perhaps I would be better served with a PlaysForSure device like a Creative Zen.
One thing is for sure - whatever the problem is, Microsoft needs to come clean with the customers. And all I smell is cover-up here.
They will continue to take us lightly, and zune will never have a respectable market share. Obviously, I won't tell someone to buy a zune with these problems. That equals less sales for microsoft. It severely stunts the growth of their player when you have huge issues such as skipping every 2 to 3 songs. If I hadn't canceled my aol music now subscription and got rid of my sandisk players, I'd drop everything right now and never look back.
But, I'm looking towards somewhere around the end of January. If this is still a problem by then, then I'm done with this. It'll be back to plays for sure for me...might even give the new Rhapsody a try.
www.zune60.net
Check out "why all zune customers are really just beta testers." We just don't get paid.
Well at least there is now a KB article at Microsoft for this problem. You gotta love their "fix" for this - read on. So we should just try the song again or not use Zune Marketplace content. I hope that this is not their bottom line. David, can you confirm that there are further efforts being placed on fixing this??
The sound or the interface pauses and resumes intermittently when you play protected audio content on a Zune device
View products that this article applies to.
Article ID : 930263
Last Review : December 23, 2006
Revision : 1.0
SYMPTOMS
When you play protected audio content on your Zune device, the sound or the interface pauses and resumes intermittently.
Back to the top
CAUSE
This behavior occurs when you play audio files that you obtained from the Zune Marketplace that use Digital Rights Management (DRM). This is a known issue with the Zune device.
Back to the top
THINGS TO TRY
1. Try to play the file again. Because the behavior is intermittent, you may not experience the same behavior when you play the song again.
2. Play files that are from a different source such as from the Zune software library on the computer.
It's interesting to me that the skipping doesn't impact every Zune. My wife and I both have a Zune and Neither of ours Skip.
Mine is completely loaded with MarketPlace tracks from the service. My wife's contains a mix some AACs, MP3s, unprotected WMAs, and some Marketplace tracks. Neither of ours skip...
I listen to mine about 8 hours straight, on battery, each day at work. My Wife has a much longer commute so she listens for longer but part of the time she uses the Car charger thing.
If I were Microsoft I'd get in touch with some of the people experiencing the Skipping and pay them to ship their Zune back. Then have the engineers strip it down and figure out why that Zune is different from so many others that are not skipping... Hopefully they've done this already..?
When downloading from the Marketplace, the Zune software occasionally locks, usually when I click on anything else on the Zune UI. Also, when ripping CDs, the Find Album Info interface sometimes locks.
Any idea when these might be fixed?
Same here. No "skipping" problem and 80% of my Zune is Marketplace.
no skipping on my unit, it is 99.9% non-marketplace music though.
It's interesting that a few people report it working. (It seems much more common for it _not_ to be working properly, though.) I wonder if there is some hardware difference.
It seems concerning that some people have reported the same problem happening on the Gigabeat. If that has been out for 6+ months with no fix, how likely is a quick fix here?
To: Adam
"I hate DRM, as it's damn near worthless at actually stopping pirates, and really only serves to piss people off because of its numerous technical problems."
I personally *like* DRM, because without it... "all you can eat" subscrption services on Yahoo! Music Unlimited, URGE or Zune Marketplace wouldn't exist.
Now, for "purchased" tracks, it's just irritating since you can just burn it to CD and it's unprotected. Stupid.
I find it hilarious how people are pissed off with their experiences and threatening to return to their iPods over their 1G Zunes.
Let's make this clear for all time, shall we?
The 1G was rushed! It's botched and riddled with bugs (specifically the software, not firmware) and errors such as these will be corrected by the time they decide to roll out new features. MS can't risk losing early adopters (or at least a substantial portion of them) as they are integral to the future of the device. They are probably investigating these problems right now.
If you bought a Zune for one feature only, then you're going to be solely disappointed and probably wasted your money. However, that is not very typical of early adopters as they usually know what they're investing. These comments just prove your ignorance of that fact.
Of course the next Zune will be a substantially better product, even any first run of a flash-based competitor may be better, because they will have more time on their hands, there's a new kind of pressure, and they'll probably do everything in house this time around.
I guess the anonymous above me does not know how bad Apple rolls out 5G "non-rushed" products, too. The iTunes 7 launch, which shipped with the latest iPods, was a total POS for many people. In fact, some people still avoid it... well, for people that can. (New iPods MUST use it.)
Sadly, I do not think Zune is any worse than any competitive product. NOTHING is perfect for everyone. For me, it has been really good so far (a "great" out of box experience) and I feel sorry for the folks that have not experienced the same.
It's funny how accusing the users of ignorance is somehow a defense of this device. "Ha! You should've known it would suck this bad!"
I fully expected a 1G product to have annoyances, glitches, etc. That is why I bought it somewhere with a clearly-defined return policy. But I never expected it to fail in such a fundamental way. Really, it's ignorant to expect it to be able to correctly play songs downloaded from Microsoft's own subscription service? Which other fundamental features should I assume will completely fail to work so I can avoid being naive?
I haven't wasted any money at all because I'm not keeping the Zune.
Hardly a problem? You gotta work for MICROSOFT. This issue plain sucks. After an hour on the phone with a operator who's accent was so thick, half the time I was asking WHAT ARE YOU SAYING TO ME? (he said he most certainly was in northern America....but what city is a SECRET.....SHHHHHHHHHHH) Yep indian operator had no idea what the hell was going on.Had to check referrence guide for every question,which meant more hold time for Me. First said it was low battery,then I was told issue was not fixable. to return the zune. After I told him that pissed me off greatly, he continued to help Me fix(piss me off...what did you say operator?...Is that English?..)He finally told me that there will be another firmware I think 1.3 but he and evryone else in that damn building had no friggin idea when its coming out, or if it will fix my problem.I asked if he thought it would be before I got pissed off and traded this paperweight in for an ipod. To think my wife had bought me an apple IPOD, but noooooo. I ,yeah me, had to go on and on about this stupid zune . So she exchanged it before christmas for the zune... Happy ending..hell no. Maybe it will be worth it in 6 or 8 months when its fixed. Oh wait! My zune pas runs out in 3 months.Doh!! So that was a waste of money too.Microsoft YOU really screwed me this time. Your becoming sony in the customer help area and now the products are going the same way...Crappy.
Ps My wife did buy me a replacment plan, But to replace it, it will cost me about 40 bucks. That covers the next zune and insurance on next one. Thats 40$ i could use on a dock a case or even the zune pass.Not to mention adding back 17 gigs of music that I hear is also a problem. Just to get back to where i started before this BS. And the added bonus QUESTION!!!! WILL THE DAMN THING WORK. I'M NOT DOING THIS OVER AND OVER.
I WOULD LIKE A RESPONSE FROM MICROSOFT
To Anonymous (this is my [Adam] other, primary account):
I love my Urge subscription, but that doesn't mean I can't hate DRM. I agree with you that the only way that the recording companies would allow a subscription service is through the use of DRM (and while I'm not thrilled, it's understandable), but for purchased media, that I paid for... that's not a license. I should own that. I shouldn't have to re-purchase my music if I go to an iPod from a Zune, or vice-versa, not to mention a PlaysForSure device. I think eMusic gets it: sell music people actually want, and they'll pay for it. I'm not a crook, I just hate feeling cheated by these faceless corporations.
Question; I'm hearing that the Zune software does not support third party extensions. The Zune calls itself "social", yet there's no support for scrobbling via last.fm, which seems somewhat odd to me. Are there any plans to add third party extension support in the future so users of the Zune can scrobble their playlists?
Shawn Wallace
www.ledgeio.com
David, happy new year to the Zune team. With CES and Vista Launch, the year looks to start with two of your best opportunities to keep the Zune buzz going. I'm expecting at least on big announcement. Good luck!
first off...
Danked?
http://www.google.com/search?client=opera&rls=en&q=define:+danked&sourceid=opera&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8
yeah, it seems like theres an awfully large amount of anonymous posting in comparison to all other posts.
anyways, contrary to all the 'hating' thats been going on here:
good job dave and the rest of the zune team, keep up the good work.
i just want 3 things from my zune
1. Sync Via WiFi
2. Drag n Drop access to my Zune
3. Better/Higher bitrate support for mp3's(i.e. 320 VBR)
i dont care if it takes a firmware hacker or ms to do this but i would be really happy if this would happen.
if MS was smart they would put these in, give us what we want and you'll steal ipod users dont and you'll have a failure. i still have 2 weeks before i cant return this, and that gen6 ipod is looking really good about now.
i just want 3 things from my zune
1. Sync Via WiFi
2. Drag n Drop access to my Zune
3. Better/Higher bitrate support for mp3's(i.e. 320 VBR)
i dont care if it takes a firmware hacker or ms to do this but i would be really happy if this would happen.
if MS was smart they would put these in, give us what we want and you'll steal ipod users dont and you'll have a failure. i still have 2 weeks before i cant return this, and that gen6 ipod is looking really good about now.
Uh, Zune Software rips to 320 Kbps MP3 NOW. That's the highest supported bitrate in the standard. There is no such thing as "320 Kbps VBR MP3." If you must use MP3, you can't beat 320 Kbps.
And if I wasn't clear, the Zune Player itself supports all types of MP3. VBR or CBR, up to 320 Kbps. FhG, LAME, whatever...
Here's a bug that I discovered and I don't know where to submit it. If you're playing a playlist in shuffle mode, the Zune stops playing songs after it has played the last song in the "sequential" list i.e. if you have 5 songs (1-5) in a list which were played in this order:
1, 5, 3, 2, 4; Zune would stop playing after the playing the 5th (last) song.
Sachin, call Zune support at get that bug logged officially!
Well, I got a zune for Xmas, and after three frustrating days, someone is going to have to convince me to keep this thing. No audiobook support for Audible.com? Have to hack around to get podcasts? Yuck. why is this darn thing so hard to figure out? I just want to play the same files I play easily on my computer now. I don't want a "community" experience -- that's what I have a family and actual friends for. I have yet to discover a compelling reason to keep the zune. It's the first mp3 type device I've ever owned, and it's just about convinced me to get an ipod.
It's funny how people think that if someone points out another's ignorance that they might really be ignorant instead of defending the product.
I got a Zune because I knew there were PRESENT ways to work around or ignore roadblocks. I don't use the marketplace (atm) and I don't use it for podcasts or Audibles, so for me, it's easy. If you really were so stupid as to buy a product if it missed a critical feature, you deserve to go back to your shitty iPods.
And nowhere was it said that iPods weren't rushed. They are all the time. Screwing people over with their minor enhancements and stuff every six months or so.
This post has been removed by a blog administrator.
This post has been removed by a blog administrator.
Sachin: I don't really think that's a bug... I'm pretty sure you have to turn on repeat to have the list keep cycling.
But on the subject: is there an official place where we can suggest features/submit bug reports? I have two (one of each):
Suggestion: A way to skip around on especially lengthy lists (like songs). One advantage the iPod clickwheel has is that it can tell velocity. Sure the D pad will speed up scrolling with more pressure, but I was thinking perhaps that by holding the play button (not pressing it as currently assigned to play/pause duties [a great feature by the way]), and pressing a direction--up or down--it would scroll one letter depending on the way it is pushed. If the direction is reversed, say, fast-scrolling down and then pressing up, it would go half-way between the letter the user was just at and the previous letter. It's kinda difficult to explain in words, but I think this would be a great feature for advanced users that wouldn't hinder new users.
And now the bug: I've noticed that embedded album art displays incorrectly when the center button is tapped, re-scaling the art to fit the window. The pixels shift to the side at about the same line as where the art was separated from the seek bar. This doesn't happen with dragged and dropped album art, and I've noticed this behavior on other Zunes, including all the test units (at Best Buy, etc.).
Thanks!
i second adams suggestion. it would make things much easier. because eventhough the zune displays the letter of the artist its going through, it can skip through rather quickly and i often overshoot a band if there arent many other that start with the same letter. also it would make navigating especially long lists, like under 'songs', even though it scrolls pretty fast it take a really long time to get through all my song names.
Now that I have had my Zune for a few weeks, here are two features I would like to see:
Audiobooks Support - It would be nice to have a resume feature here. It would also be nice if my Audiobooks were not in with my music so that I can use the random play feature.
Podcast Support - Like audiobooks, it would be nice if they were segregated in some way.
I think all these issues are pretty much outside of "basic" usage, but I just thought of another suggestion: on audio files of more than, say, 10/30/60 minutes, it'll auto-bookmark, just like with videos. Another thought would be to have audio flagged (within the Zune software) to set bookmarks. Or there could be an option to manually set a bookmark in the song context menu. I realize this would be difficult to impliment, especially without over-complicating the interface, but I think it would be nice.
I like listening to standup when I'm riding the subway, it keeps me occupied and stops me from going crazy :)
skipping music falls outside basic usage??? Oh.....
All it takes is a little bit of research.
A fix for the skipping problem: Turn your backlight on. Set it to low if you want. But that seems to work for almost everyone who's tried it.
I do not have to "hack around" to get my podcasts to play. I use Doppler to catch podcasts. I added the folder that Doppler downloads to to my Zune software. It'd be nice if the Zune software had a podcast catcher, but it's not a big problem.
I'm not affiliated with the following website, but it has lots of great information. www.zunerama.com then go to the forums.
Interesting Richard...especially since I've always kept my backlight on. Nice try...doesn't work.
Adam, it's a bug, Zune should only stop playing once all the songs in a playlist are played. Suppose you have 100+ songs in a playlist and in shuffle mode Zune plays the last song (in the sequential list) first, do you think it is alright to stop playing after just one song even though there were 99 more songs that it never played even once?
Ohh... I guess I didn't understand your problem. Yeah, that does seem kinda bad. Have you called tech support?
Call tech support? Your kidding right? *rolls eyes* Spoken like someone who has never called tech support.
I called tech support and spoke with Jennifer (except she said "Tank vu fer calling Tech Support thise Henfer")
Yes my name is Chris and I'm calling about the skipping problem. (Her) Skipping problem? We've never heard of that happening.
(Me)Your #%@%$&@^%@%@ kidding right. It's all over the internet. One of the designers David Caulton should be aware of it as it's mentioned on his blog!!!!!!
blah, blah, blah...
David and the Zune team your losing people who want to really like Microsoft. The ZUNE has potential! But somebody please say that we recognize there is a problem and tell me your working on it. Don't give me cheesy fixes like "Leave your backlight on".
I've sent emails, I've called Tech support, I've left messages on blogs and yet nobody responds.
Agreed - In the 2 weeks since there was an official KB entry over at the land of MS there has been no forward movement and in fact, even here it appears that David is trying to obfuscate around this issue - changing the title of the entry and burying it deep, deep within his blog underneath all of this useless crap about how much better Zune Marketplace is than the Apple Store. David - here's some advice from a consumer (those folks you actually made the Zune for, remember?) - acknowledge the problem and let us consumers know what the status of a fix is. If you have no clue, tell us - we'll forgive you. After all, it certainly won't be the first time that Microsoft has released a product with inadequate (embarrassingly inadequate) testing. Yeah, you made the 2006 Christmas marketing season but seriously, at this rate the Zunes will be selling on e-bay, iPods and Zens will be happily purchased and us consumers will be left with another bad taste about Microsofts' commitment to quality. Vista anyone? HA - maybe after SP2!
Welcome to the social my ass....
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